Ep. 41 - Recovering the Pre-Colonial Past (History of Korean Western Theatre)

PuSh Play

Gabrielle Martin chats with Jaha Koo, the artist behind The History of Korean Western Theatre, which will be presented at the 2025 PuSh Festival. The History of Korean Western Theatre will be produced by CAMPO at The Roundhouse on January 23 and 24, 2025.

Show Notes

Gabrielle and Jaha discuss:

• What is the role of drama and history in reclaiming the pre-colonial past?

• Why hamartia, or tragic error, for the title of the trilogy of work?

• What western or eastern influences do you perceive on your work? How do these aesthetics complement or come into tension with each other?

• How do you see your practice evolving over the past eight years up to the current production?

• What did it mean to become a father during the creation of this trilogy?

• What creative risks and experiments are you embracing going forward? What’s next for you?

• What are the differences between audiences and responses between east Asia and elsewhere?

About Jaha Koo

Jaha Koo (he/him) is a South Korean theatre/performance maker, music composer and videographer. His artistic practice oscillates between multimedia and performance, encompassing his own music, video, text, and robotic objects.

His most recent project, the Hamartia Trilogy, includes Lolling and Rolling (2015), Cuckoo (2017) and The History of Korean Western Theatre (2020). The trilogy represents a long-term exploration of the political landscape, colonial history and cultural identity of East Asia. Thematically, it focuses on structural issues in Korean society and how the inescapable past tragically affects our lives today. Currently, Koo is working on a new creation, Haribo Kimchi, scheduled to premiere in 2024.

Koo majored in Theatre Studies (BFA, 2011) at Korea National University of Arts and earned a master's degree (MA, 2016) at DAS Theatre in Amsterdam.

Land Acknowledgement

This conversation was recorded on the unceded, stolen and ancestral territories of the Coast Salish Peoples: the xʷməθkʷəy̓əm (Musqueam), Skwxwú7mesh (Squamish) and Səl̓ílwətaɬ (Tsleil-Waututh), colonially known as Vancouver. Jaha joined the remote recording from Ghent, Belgium.

It is our duty to establish right relations with the people on whose territories we live and work, and with the land itself.

Show Transcript

00:02

Hello and welcome to Push Play, a Push Festival podcast featuring conversations with artists who are pushing boundaries and playing with form. I'm Gabrielle Martin, Push's Director of Programming, and today's episode highlights multimedia practice and finding one's artistic authenticity in relation to the Western theater canon.

00:19

I'm speaking with Jiaha Koo, the artist behind the history of Korean Western theater, which is being presented at the Push Festival January 23rd to 24th, 2025. This visionary documentary theater performance examines how the suppression of culture under Western assimilation has shaped Korean theater and by extension the national identity of South Korea.

00:40

Through a patchwork of personal narratives and historical analysis, it offers a deeply authentic perspective on the past and defiantly imagines a future free from cultural erasure. Jiaha Koo is a South Korean theater performance maker, music composer, and videographer.

00:57

His artistic practice oscillates between multimedia and performance, encompassing his own music, video, text, and robotic objects. Here is my conversation with Jiaha. In 2025, this will be the third time that you're going to come with your work to Vancouver.

01:15

The first time was with Kukwoo in 2020 and then Lalling and Rolling in 2023 and now 2025, the history of Korean Western theater. So it's just a really nice evolution for us to follow the evolution of your practice and just be in relationship with you and the themes that you're working with.

01:38

I'm very honored to present my Trilog works, Everything in Vancouver. So I'm very excited to meet audience to share my last piece of the Trilog, yes. And we're speaking about Vancouver and Vancouver is how this place is colonially known, but it is the stolen traditional and ancestral.

02:00

territories of the Coast Salish peoples, the Musqueam Squamish, and Tsleil -Waututh, and I'm a settler here, and part of my responsibility is ongoing learning about the colonial past and participating in a reclaiming of history and imagining of possible decolonial futures.

02:21

Today I'm really inspired by a podcast which is more like an intersection between documentary theater and a weaving of critical fabulation and historical documentation, a podcast called Marguerite La Traversé by Emily Monet, who was here at Porsche in 2023 with her work Oakenham.

02:48

And listening to this project has been very educational for me. It centers around Marguerite Du Plessy, an indigenous woman who was also a slave in the 1700s in Quebec. And this woman is the first enslaved person who took recourse to the justice system to have her freedom recognized in 1740.

03:08

And it's been really eye opening to realize the history, you know, in the 1700s at 90% of the slave population were indigenous people. And the other thing that's been critical fabulation, the need to the role of drama and imagining history as part of reclaiming the forgotten and erased histories of the past.

03:46

So for our listeners, I encourage you to check that out. And today, Zaha, where are you joining the conversation from? Now, I'm currently in Ghent, in Belgium, in the studio of Kampo, where I'm working with the last five years, I'm associate artist of Kampo, the production house in Ghent.

04:11

Yes. And this now is Friday evening, but I'm still in the studio. Yeah. Well, let's talk about what your work is in the studio or what you've been working on. So the history of Korean Western theater is the final part of your Hamartia trilogy.

04:28

And this word means tragic error in Greek. Why tragic error as a title for the trilogy and what makes these works a trilogy? I think this is really nice question to open up our conversation because it's really ironic and paradox why I made Hamartia trilogy as my title.

04:51

Actually, this is really related to the last piece, the history of Korean Western theater. Actually, I made the concept and plan of this trajectory in 2014. At the time, I already made the idea about rolling and rolling, and cuckoo, and the history of Korean music theater.

05:15

And this project was about imperialism and colonialism, and how to reflect the past, the tragic past, and for the future, actually. Because actually, we don't know what kind of tragic past are staying with in our life, but actually, there are many things, many layers, and then this kind of tragic trap is still going on with us.

05:45

So that was a really big inspiration for me. the history of Korean Western theater, actually the motivation is very important to talk about why I made the Hamartia trilogy. In 2008, you know, I was a student studying theater studies in the university and by extent I went to want a big celebration in the theater in Seoul, South Korea.

06:15

Then they were really excited and then I was curious what kind of event and it was 100th anniversary of Korean theater. Wow, 100 years. And then suddenly I made a question myself, which country or which culture can count the age of theater history?

06:40

That's really strange because we learned that theater history started already before, you know, like more than southern or 2000, we never knew. But they are counting the history like, yes, 100 years anniversary.

06:56

That's really strange. And then I tried to research and then think about what's the starting point. Actually it was 100th anniversary of Western style theater in Korea. So it means that their theater is based on Western theater.

07:15

So it's really separated from Korean traditional theater or Korean folk theater. And modernization was a kind of foundation, kind of like barometer. We have to throw away our past and then we have to make a new feature based on Western canon.

07:37

That was the mentality of the modernization. I think there is no autonomous modernization in the concept. So that was motivation for me about the history of Korean theater. And why? You know, I wanted to talk about my theater, my route, but and I realized that I don't have my authentic knowledge, and my tone, and my, how can I say, my route.

08:11

So everything that I what I learned, actually, it's from Western theater. So there was no time to identify myself, culturally. So conceptually, at the same time, part of schooling, I wanted to bring Amartya from artists to tourist weddings, because that was only one term that I learned.

08:40

So you're talking about, you know, the history of Korean Western theater, examining the history of theater. history of colonization and Western influences. You moved to Amsterdam in 2011. You did a master's at Daz Arts in Amsterdam and then moved to Belgium in 2016.

09:05

So as you've referenced a lot of your, and before that, as you've just said, like a lot of your theater education was based in a Western tradition. I'm curious if you could speak, I would love to hear you speak more about how you, what Western influences you perceive on your work and Eastern influences, or just to kind of talk about those aesthetic, the ways that those aesthetics complement each other or maybe come into tension in your practice or in your context.

09:42

When I look back, when I was living in South Korea in 2010, the Korean theater scene was very conservative and very hierarchical structure. In that structure, I found that it's not easy to make artistic growth myself because the structure forced younger generation to follow their Western canon in a different way because I have to talk about the Western canon.

10:21

Actually, it was interpreted by Japanese people during Japanese colonial period. So it's kind of like monster Western canon. It's not authentic Western canon. So in this sense, the conservative scene always divided like theater, dance, and multidisciplinary performance and visual art performance.

10:48

So there was no synergy to each other. There was no kind of good reaction or feel like each other. I wanted to escape and avoid it from this structure. And then I wanted to figure out what I want in my artistic practice.

11:07

Fortunately, at that time, performance works that I was inspired and I like. Actually, it was from Belgium and Germany, actually. This is really funny because I was thinking about what is our own theater.

11:25

But at the same time, I like and I'm inspired from European theater. But there was something different because what is contemporary. I was inspired by the meaning of contemporary. And then I found maybe I can establish what I want.

11:45

want what I wish in my artistic practice. That's why that was the reason I decided to leave. Of course, in European theater, after that I learned that in European theater also really divided like a classical theater and contemporary theater.

12:01

But somehow one is really important is that the diversity and international experiences and then different cultural moments that I really appreciate. It's really different from Korean theater because there is a North Korea, so geographically it's a part of the continent, but politically it's an island, so it's really isolated politically.

12:35

In this sense, there was kind of artistic liberation myself. That was the 13th point. As you mentioned, in 2011 I moved to Europe and I studied my master's program in Amsterdam from 2012 and then I moved to Belgium from the Netherlands in 2016.

12:59

In that period, I got a big question myself. I have to admit that my artistic background and my artistic practice are rooted based on European theater. I think this is the reality that I had already from South Korea when I was a student.

13:26

So in this sense, when I decided to make the history of Korean Western theater, it was a big issue for myself. How to figure out and how to develop further based on my own authenticity. Honestly, I don't know yet, but every different project I try to develop further, I think in that sense, the history of Korean Western theater is kind of like a hunting point for me to think about the future, what is autonomous modernization or artistic practice.

14:09

So in my artist practice, how to develop my own aesthetic quality and how to make the new contemporary Korean artistic aesthetics, for example, even though I live in Europe. I think this is a great moment to talk a little bit more about how you see your practice as having evolved from lolling and rolling to the history of Korean Western theater across this 10 years.

14:43

Or I guess it was eight years by the time, yeah, that last work premiered. Audience, audience members, maybe someone already saw my previous work, like Lo Ling and Lo Ling and Cuckoo. Maybe they already recognize who I am as an artist, maybe.

15:01

Basically, I'm a theater maker, but also I'm a composer, music composer and video artist. So always multi -media elements are important and I believe that music and video are my performers and my artistic languages.

15:23

So always how to organize the musicality and then how to make multi -sensure drama thirds and structure in my performance, they are really important. So from Lo Ling and Lo Ling, I already tried to organize my video work as a performance language.

15:44

In the meantime, my own music can talk about so many subjects itself. After that, I want you to go further with my multidisciplinary elements and then I start you to develop my robot performers. And of course, rice cookers perform in cuckoo.

16:05

And actually, the one of rice cooker will come back to Vancouver with the history of Korean written theater. Of course, in the performance, there is also new robot performer. The important is about, I already mentioned about future, but in the practice, in the project, Lo Ling and Lo Ling and Cuckoo, they are mainly focusing on the past.

16:33

So what was tragic past and what kind of effect, what kind of tragic effect on our lives today? But the history of Koreanness and theater doesn't stop at present. So it goes further to the future. And then how to reverse our future and how to unfold and fold a new feature.

16:58

That is an artistic question, actually. So in the sense, I try to bring Korean folk theater and dance into my music and video work at the same time, even though I'm not dancer, but I try to practice on the stage my own choreography.

17:16

And then furthermore, there is a new character that I mentioned, the robot character. Actually, it's my son. My son was born during the creation of the history of Koreanness and theater. And then I tried to imagine the future together.

17:35

How can I say? It can be a little bit kitschy and a little bit cute way, but somehow that was a reality because, you know, I became father during the creation of the Hamatiya trilogy. And then it gave me many different layers and it gave me many different realities.

18:02

So I couldn't have to think about my chart and then future generation as well. So in the sense, the history of Korean S &P author is a perfectly, I would say it's a final piece of the Hamatiya trilogy to close, to wrap up the trajectory.

18:22

And now that you've completed the trilogy, will you continue to work with the self -solo form? I mean, I reference these pieces as solos, but as you've just said, you have other characters on stage, robotic characters, rice cookers, et cetera.

18:41

I'm just curious what kind of creative risks you are embracing. You just premiered a new work since this trilogy. So yeah, can you tell us about your current experimentations with form or thematics, et cetera?

18:59

Oh, you mean the related to my new performances, the new work together? Yeah, I guess the question is what's next for you now that this trilogy that you've been working on for so long has completed, what's next for you artistically?

19:14

Hamatiya trilogy is my first chapter in my artistic career. And to see the second chapter, the first chapter is really important, of course. So in the first chapter, the Hamatiya trilogy is like autobiography storytelling.

19:38

and sometimes lecture performance, sometimes documentary performance, documentary theater. So every time in a different way, I try to develop a little bit further. And one day I realized Matia too large is completely about myself.

19:58

And then if I'm not in the topic or I'm not in the work, then what kind of challenge happened? I thought this is quite crucial and important and relevant question for me as an artist. So recently I made Playboo Kimchi.

20:24

It's about food and it's about diasporic status who lives outside of the hometown. So in this sense, I want you to develop. how to organize narrative in the performance. And for example, the Hamatea theology is more like the documentary stories, but Haribo kimchi is more like fictional, but plus personal stories, it's kind of like mixture.

20:54

So I try to make a distance between my work and my self and then in between the distance, I think my musicality and my video work and my installation work, my cinematography and my robot performance can do many things.

21:13

In the sense that my work can transform into another way, I think. So kind of like in the middle of the transition. So after Haribo kimchi, I want to try next work and not on the stage, for example. And then if I'm not in the performance, what kind of artistic urgency?

21:41

And your work has toured extensively internationally. What would you say are the differences between audiences, connections, or responses to your work in East Asia or elsewhere? Amartya Tillers, yes, he was shown in a different continent and different cities.

22:05

Luckily, I'm so appreciative of opportunities because I was able to see many different audiences and then they gave me many different reactions. In European countries, there are also similar experiences like East Asia economic crisis.

22:26

It was also happened during like 2008, around 2008 in Greece or Spain or Italy. So we were able to share a common feeling and experiences and a harsh time, so the emotional engagement was totally different, so the kind of reaction was also really different in European countries.

22:57

Sometimes, you know, some countries, I feel like, wow, in East Asia, you had a hard time. Sometimes, you know, in this kind of conversation, I can feel also this connection, because audience can think this is really far story, you know, it's not our story, it's your story, something like that.

23:23

But mostly, international audience gave me intimacy and engagement to share their experience. So even though I'm talking about Korean history and political matters, every country, they have their own stories and their background and their problems.

23:46

So even though I'm talking about Korean stories, it automatically transforms into the local stories that I was really surprised from their reaction. On the other hand, when I perform in Asia, it's quite different because like Kuku or the history of Korean theater, this kind of work, you know, they have different understanding depending on the political landscape.

24:20

So different perspective can be shared. For example, different interpretations about Japanese colonialism between Taiwan and Korea also. Of course, I respect their opinion and their decision, but somehow it was quite different interpretation I found.

24:42

So it was also a fruitful experience for me to see the different dimensions of perception. In Taiwan specifically was your last reference, one last thing. Last year, I performed Amatya trilogy in Seoul altogether.

25:01

I was quite surprised from the reaction because, you know, the history of Korean based theater, it's still going on in their history and in their art scene and in their society. So I was able to feel their anger, but at the same time, some conservative audiences, they were really angry, for example.

25:37

After the show, some people sent me a message via Instagram, we never give the right to talk about Korean theater at the outside of South Korea. At the time I was hurt and I was sad, you know, I left 10 years ago, more than 10 years ago, this colonial remnant is still going on in our contemporary society.

26:06

Last 13 years, my cultural identity is also getting changed. When I go to South Korea, they treat me as the Korean who live outside, so it's kind of like a stranger. But in European society, I'm still South Korean, I'm not a European, so I'm still living kind of like in between culture.

26:34

films. So in this sense, my perspective is losing the power as a Korean. That is quite sad. Somehow as a person who can see the society with distance as a start viewpoint, the history of the history of Korean medicine theater is still very valid in Korean theater scene that I was able to observe and to see the society last year.

27:14

Yeah, the themes of your work are so relevant here, as in many places of the world, as you know, you're talking about, or the work is addressing themes of imperialism and colonization with walling and rolling, specifically language imperialism, with the cultural genocide that took place here and continues in many ways.

27:38

It's very relevant. It's always interesting to identify parallels with other places in the world. There's so much knowledge of specific Asian history, I feel here, that having this kind of opportunity to connect through you and your story and your perspective.

28:03

I think it's also really beautiful how you do with each work, weave in the personal in a way that makes it very, very emotionally touching, very concrete, and very accessible. I am thrilled. Thank you so much.

28:19

Thank you for this conversation. Thank you for coming back to Push. I so look forward to welcoming this piece. Actually, this was the first, the history of Korean Western theater was the first piece of yours that I saw, so it was my introduction.

28:34

to your work because Cuckoo was presented at Push Before My Time and then we brought Lalling and Rolling which was the first piece in the trilogy in 2023 so it's yeah I'm just very excited for our audiences to get to this to experience this this part and the and for those lucky audience members who will have experienced all three over the the last four or five years that's just awesome so thank you again for your time.

29:01

Thank you very much I'm so honored and I'm so excited to meet first of all audience talking and then I'm so happy I can share like fully know completely all trilogy in Vancouver. Thanks a lot. That was Jaha Koo, the artist behind the history of Korean Western Theatre with Gabriel Martin.

29:26

Jaha's new piece will be presented during the 2025 Push Festival, January 23rd to February 9th in Vancouver, B .C. The history of Korean Western Theatre will be produced by Campo at the Roundhouse on January 23rd and 24th.

29:41

It's the third in his trilogy of shows that has been produced at Push, so for fans of Koo Koo and Lulling and Rolling, you don't want to miss this one. Thanks so much for joining us. I'm Trisha Knowles.

29:54

I'm one of the producers of this podcast along with the lovely button, Charlynd. Special thanks to Joseph Hirabayashi for the original music composition. New episodes of Push Play are released every Tuesday and Friday, wherever you get your podcasts.

30:07

Coming up on the next Push Play. So it all started with fairy lights from Dolorama, cooking paper and origami as a pair of pantyhose. So it's just like to bring it down to earth.