Feminism & The Church

Old Fashion Dad Podcast

We recorded this episode the summer of 2021 with return guests, Julia Bringolf and Stacy Manning. In this lively discussion, we get into the topic of Feminism, the varies waves of the feminist movement and the impact it's had on the church and society at large.

NOTES:

•Recorded August 26, 2021 - released December 4, 2021

•This Weeks Whiskey: Bourbon from Willy's Distillery, Ennis, MT

•(Return) Guests (from Ep. 47 on Masculinity from a wives perspective):

•Julia Bringolf - Christian Bringolf's wife

•Stacy Manning - Co-Author of "Them Before Us, Why We Need a global Children's Rights Movement"

•If feminism is such a good thing, why are there 4 generations / iterations of it (1-4th waive feminism)?

•The feminist movement was really born out of men abdicating their responsibility to lead and take care of woman (Feminism was a response to an injustice in the world).

•Freedom and right to provide for ourselves are essential in life and some would say the Suffrage Movement was born out of that - woman fighting for the right for woman to vote, own land and work.

•The leaders of the suffrage movement were largely affluent, high-society woman who needed something to do with their time - They weren't fighting for woman to work in factories... they wanted woman in board rooms. They wanted the "privileges" of the men of that day, without the responsibility's (going to war, fighting fires, put themselves in harms way)

•Ironically, it took a government of men to vote to give women the right to vote.

•Original feminism still allowed for glorifying God and honoring biblical gender identity.

•As feminism gained traction and saw wins for Woman's rights, the fight shifted away from fighting for woman's rights and became about fighting agains men and in the 1960's, the fight for freedom and equality became a fight for "being better" than men, which includes sexual autonomy and breaking of sexual boundaries... which doesn't honor God.

•Today's feminism has become ugly and not glorifying to God.

•"When woman received the right to vote, the country started pivoting to the left... because woman seek security and generally don't take the same risks men are willing to... and were more willing to vote [tax payer] money into their own pockets" - Stacy

•Too many women felt like they couldn't rely on their husbands (men weren't doing their job), so in order to get the security they desired, they used the vote to have the government step in and start taking care of them (replacing the role of the family, men in particular).

•The Bible says that the husband (man) is the head of the house, like Christ is the head of the church, and with that comes a sense of power. In a biblical world, the one "in charge" takes responsibility for those under them, those in their care.

•Adam's first sin was abdicating his headship and care of Eve.

•For much of human history, woman were second-class citizens, less than men, subjugated and even seen as property... which is never how it was intended. When God created Adam and Eve, it was in a complimentarian context, where man and woman were distinct and different and designed to compliment one another.

•Men and women represent the different halves and characteristics of God... without each other, this world is not complete.

•In all the discussion around feminism and equality of the sexes, the issue os sin is never talked about and that is the real issue (with everything).

•Phases of Feminism:

•1st wave: 1900s-1930s (woman's suffrage movement)

•2nd wave: 1940s-1960s (men going to war while woman went to work outside the house & post-war autonomy where woman (the parents of the hippy generation) pushed back against traditional gender roles of having to go back to working in the home)

•3rd wave: 1960s- (Sexual revolution where woman wanted to be as "free" and promiscuous as men, though hippy culture was very small in the context of the larger American society at the time)

•4th wave: (Modern feminism which says that men and women are exactly the same, gender is a social construct and men aren't necessary or even that men are bad)

•"Of course women needed a seat at the table... but then they got up and started dancing on it" - Stacy

•It didn't take long before feminism started serving men.

•What is the difference between "rights" and "entitlement"

•Rights are inherent and can't be something that someone else needs to provide to you.

•Women's rights are the same as men's rights... they are human rights.

•Injustice is when someone infringes on someone else's God given rights.

•Going back to the idea that you have to have "skin in the game" in order to have a say in the community (having the privilege to vote), makes a lot of sense (Property owners, business owners, job creators and the producers in society... so you don't have non-producers voting to take money and resources away from the producers).

•Male feminist ("meneminists") are not sexy - the grossest of the gross. Men have been conditioned to believe if they don't support feminism, they'll be accused of hating women.

•We are for women... just like God is. Jesus was the original "feminist" in the sense of giving women credit and honor (In the honoring ways He interacted with them and in how scripture records it was the woman that first reported that Jesus's tomb was empty (back in that day, a woman't testimony was not to be trusted).

•At the end of the day, Feminism is really rooted in the hatred of men and hate the traditional gender roles (the one's that God designed)

•Feminism is often a gateway into leftism in the church (A woman pastor or woman leaders of a church). The only people you find that attend churches pastor by women are emasculated boys and women.

•The Church is loosing because it doesn't value God's Word anymore and is more concerned about fitting in with a fallen culture, than boldly proclaiming and living God's truth.

•As societies become more affluent we start believing the lie that we are in control of our lives and the world around. We start thinking we are god, instead of relying on God.

•When you become comfortable and secure, we don't feel like we have a need for God.

•As you get further away from living lives of day-to-day survival, people need a sense of purpose and struggle, so they make up asinine ideas and movements to take up their free-time (think CRT or Black Lives Matter).

•As a modern society, we tend to look down our nose at the past, thinking we are so much more advanced then those primitive people who believed silly things and did terrible things... failing to see that in our "chronological snobbery" and arrogance, human nature has not changed and we are guilty of the same sins as our forefathers (and maybe worse with the millions of babies we've allowed to be murdered through abortion)... and the future generations will judge us in the same way.

•Feminism is an antithetical worldview to the gospel of Jesus. It can not save us... or women and at this point, only creates more division between men and woman, but putting our hope in God, brings us together and deals with our root problem of sin.

•Just Thinking Podcast episode reference: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/just-thinking-podcast/id1328733796?i=1000528814664

Questions:

1. is feminism a good thing?

0.How did we get feminism?

0.At the core, what does feminism say?

0.If you don’t agree with feminism, are you against women’s rights?

0.Is feminism another gospel that the church has accepted?

0.Why do you think the church has capitulated to feminism?

0.How is feminism dangerous to the church?

0.How should Bible believing Christians respond to the pseudo gospel of feminism?

0.How is Jesus greater than feminism?

Quotes: from the just thinking podcast episode 112, “regardless of how you slice it, 3rd and 4th wave feminism demands the deconstruction of any system seen as patriarchal. This wave of feminism isn’t about being equal to men, it’s about a lack of need for men. As men are seen as the primary problem in a society that oppresses women.”

“At the root of the concept of egalitarianism is the idea of equality. The Oxford dictionary defines egalitarianism as the belief that everyone is equal and should have the same rights and opportunities; the idea of ecclesiastical egalitarianism in the church, specifically as it relates to professing Christians who believe that women being allowed to preach from the pulpit is a matter of equality rather than the authority of scripture is in many ways similar to the logic that drives CRT. Equality is the same thread that runs through both”

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